some people say kick boxers would fare better than boxers, i belive through my experiences with wrestling that kick boxers would do bad and i have proof, of world class muay thai fighters that are undefeated getting their ass handed to them in MMA, and im not even talking about muay thai im talking about kickboxing the k-1 spinkick stuff. The reason isay this is when you kick you leave your self open to sweeps and leg picks, if this was one of my wrest;ling matches and i kid threw a leg at me im going take his ass down because when you kick you are off balance. Also they have no real inside game you see those MMa Ko's where the get dropped because they were off balance trying to use kicks in their opponents punching range, which could also hurt in street fighting where you have very little space as people crowd around you.

at least boxers have balance, of course you need more than striking im just comparing the two.

the 3 main flaws with kick boxers are
-easy to take down
-no inside game
- easy to sweep

Not always true because Andrei Arlovski is Sambo/Kickboxing and he is one of the best and if you want to talk about straight Kickboxers the all I have too say is Cro-Cop he is a premiere fighter in Pride and he is a kickboxer.

Also Allistair Overeem is a very good fighter and he is a kickboxer.

key word SUMBO
and those guys were trained to defend against take downs, UFc signed the best Muay thai fighter in the world to a contract and he hasnt lived up to expectations

never seen him fight im just going on the basis of the sport, on the fundamentals of course, the fighters you mention along with chuck liddel have tweaked their game to point where they use kicks only to keep their opponent on the outside, a rokie mistake in MMa is to kick from to close because thats either a takedown or KO

You wont see k-1 stuff in pride

Alright then forget Arlovski what do you have to say about Mirko "Cro-Cop" Fillipovic and Allistar Overeem. And if you are talking about Kit Cope just think about the differences between Muy-Thai and UFC fighting. In Muy-Thai you cannot be taken down and submitted it takes time to adjust to the different circumstances which in his case are major.

And for the boxers being better at MMA is bull because all you have to do is get a boxer on the ground and he is finished all a boxer can do in MMA is swing for the fences they often have no skills outside of that. Kicking works against wrestlers just ask charles McCarthy what happend when he tried to shoot in on David Loiseau while Loiseau was kicking he got his chest kicked thru his back.

I honestly think kickboxers would be better than boxers in MMA. They have more weapons to use and I've seen plenty of MMA fights which were straight kickboxing matches that never went to the ground. Wrestlers though are the dominant fighters in MMA though. Sambo, Judo, Jiu-jitsu, Greco-Roman are all forms of wrestling which have done well in MMA.

What Cro-Cop's main weapon is his kicking and he kicks everyones ass with it he is strictly kickboxing you should see what he did to Fedor Emilianenko's face with his kicks and Fedor is the greatest MMA fighter of all-time. Loiseau always kicks in close and catches guys.

fedor is a great sumbo wresler as well he knows how to control the body in his grappling.

yea but all the guys citiboy have mentioned are the ones that have defense against takedowns if you put a straight kick boxer in the ring/octagon against a smma fighter vs putting a boxer in same situation the boxer would farebetter because of his inside game, honeslty when was the last time you saw asuccesful spin kick in MMA,

they are off balance, next time you watch a Ko flick of Mma count the ones that were because of offbalnce due to kicks, i find that thats the second to ground and pound.

You say a wrestler would kill a guy who was a kickboxer in MMA right Kevin Randleman is a worldclass wrestler and he got his ass kicked by Cro-Cop.

The last succesful spin kick I saw was when David Loiseau kicked Charles McCarthy's chest thru his back it was the most devastating thing I have ever seen in a MMA fight outside of a huge slam.

once again this is a topic about western kickboxing not muay thai, saying that there have been numerous busts in MMa that have signed big contracts come straight from bare knuckle tourneys and fail because they cant adjust to wher takedowns, throws, and sweeps are legal. They have also tried adjusting to grappling but have a difficult time because of a lack of balance, also foreign fighters have better balance then american fighters, thats a fact, they are just taught better in kick boxing.

But I also consider Sambo and Jiu-jitsu wrestling as well.

why did guys like Kit fail the guy from the MTV show True life, he was the best Muat Thai fighter in America, and arguably the world in his weight class and has failed to live up to his big contract.

and if you are comparing striking to grappling, grappling should win

I'm not talking about Muay Thai Cro-Cop is a kick boxer and he destroyed Mark Coleman and kevin Randleman who are regarde as two of the best wrestlers in MMA. So where do you see Muay Thai in anything I have been talking about outside of Kit Cope.

once again they are somewhat different because i have neverdone sumbo i have started judo which is the father of both arts, there is alot more emphasis on control of the body and the ground postitions, then in wrestling which i also do, which is great for takedowns.

I agree with you there. There are different forms of kickboxing and what Cro-Cop does is very effective. One of the most lethal kicks I have witnessed in the ring.

If you are talking about just strictly American Kickboxing then I will give you another succesful Kickboxer in MMA. Maurice Smith was very succesful in MMA he beat alot of great guys and he was a kickboxer.

cro cro is croation meaning he sis porbably taught better than american and canadian kickboxers

But yet an American kickboxer Maurice Smith beat Mark Coleman in his prime and kevin Randleman who are wrestlers.

There is an old form of wrestling which was the father to folkstyle, freestyle, and Greco-Roman Wrestling which was called Catch Wrestling.

Catch wrestling was a form which was designed to put wrestlers into submission moves. It was what Pro wrestling was before it became fake.

Submission Grappling is a very close desendant of this art. In fact in the 19th century Pro wrestling was MMA without the striking. The wrestlers back then used to fight against the Judo and jui-jitsu guys with a lot of success. Only the Gracies in the early part of the 20th Century could take on the old legit Pro Wrestlers who did catch wrestling.

while your at why not name slvia the guy that beat rampage and every other succesful kickboxer in MMa i admit some have been succesful but technically speaking they dont stand a chance, and randy couture is what is great example of what a mma fighter should be, he has great boxing skills and takedowns thats why he has beaten numerous kick bxers like smith, liddel, graham, and another of my favs victor belfort

WTF are you talking about all the guys I named were kickboxers so where the fuck does Wanderlei Silva who is a Muay Thai guy even figure into this conversation Belfort is BJJ expert and Couture got KO'd by Lidell twice I have proven my case that Kickboxers far better in MMA than boxers and there is nothing else to be said.

muay thai is a form of muay thai and i was being sarcastic
how the best kick boxers in the world have tried mma and allot have failed its like nba and high school players a handful suceed and alot fail

and did i say Victor belfort was a kick boxer if anything he has great hands not kcikcs, and yes he is from brazil no shit he knows brazilian jujitsu.victor is one of my favorite fighters, i didnt mean to mention him as a kick boxer i was just naming notable wins and victor was the first to pop in my head.

by the way have you ever played these sports so before you rush to a concl. there is plenty to be debated.

No but I boxed for a little whil until I got stabbed in the stomach and gained like 40 pounds while I was fucked up I since lost the weight but never went back too boxing I would have wrestled but my school didnt have it.

i didnt mean it as a attack on your credabillity just there is no rush to conclustion about this topic, i admit i rushed to coclustion because of the some dissappointments of some kickboxers who i thought were going to develop a groundgame, and a improved punching technique, but they havent lived it up.

though style wise i stay true to the fact that kickboxers are not suited because the basic moves in amatuer wrestling are the leg picks, and double leg takedowns. i also dont like how kick boxers stand, buts thats something different, as for street fighting it depends on the space given if you have a circle of people around you that means that you prolly gonna have to box, and plus most people naturally punch instead of kick, and i could talk to you about monkeys and kickboxing but i dont want to get in to that right now. Fighters are different i guess guys like cro cro are just fighters and can adjust to anything i remmeber watching a dvd of ufc 1, a handful of strikers got beat easy by royce gracie and shamrock, thats how i feel that grapplers are better than strikers. but overall game is the best.

I think kickboxers could do just as well as boxers coming into MMA mainly because of leg kicks. Leg kicks are pretty detrimental in MMA when it comes to wearing out your opponents footwork and making them flatfooted. A perfect example is Lee Murray vs Anderson Silva. Silva specializes in Muay Thai for the most part while Murray is straightup boxing. Silva didn't allow Murray to get into his boxing game on the inside at all because he was hitting Murray with quick, swift, HARD leg kicks throughout the fight. If you watch it his plan works perfectly at the beginning of the fight Murray has good footwork and lateral movement by the end he is flatfooted from his legs hurting so badly and he is worn out. By the late part of the 2nd round of that fight Silva was virtually able to do whatever he wanted with Murray standing up and was landing kicks and punches at will.

Being a kickboxer can be a very good asset in MMA because leg kicks can totally take a person with a good inside game and boxing game out of their element. High kicks and body kicks are pretty risky though against a wrestler or a good grappler because they can catch them and take that kickboxer down with ease though.

Another example of effective Muay Thai fighters in MMA are the Chute Boxe fight group from Brazil. Sure some of them know some BJJ but for the most part guys like Shogun and Wand Silva thrive off of their Muay Thai tactics and inside fighting is one of the best attributes with Muay Thai because of the fact that they can fight from the clinch and throw devestating knees to the body and the face.

Oh you weren't talking about Muay Thai.

My bad.